Friday, May 18, 2012

Fred Cherry and Friends: The Untold Story

"Why is This Ring Necessary? Haven't there been reports of Fred's untimely demise? What more is to be gained by talking about him?" Reasonable questions, demanding reasonable answers. The most obvious answer is that, once one is able to separate oneself from the aggravating realities of the experience, it's a funny story, if in a very sad way. But, aside from that, the story isn't really over, even if Fred has passed away - and false reports of things like that are not unknown on the Internet. The story isn't over, because even if Fred is gone, his words live on, and the rumor mill is still going. Consider the experiences of one Susan Cohen who, even if she is being a very good sport about the whole thing, is still being harassed. Consider this post from November 2004, well over a year after Cherry's reported death.

Date: 25 Nov 2004 03:38:27 -0000
Message-ID: <>
From: Ken LewisNAMBLA <>
Subject: Call/Visit Me-Susan Cohen;Discuss NAMBLA
Newsgroups: soc.culture.usa, soc.culture.america, soc.culture.american,

From: (John Poindexter)
Subject: Re: NAMBLA-A Conduit for Pedophiles;Visit Me
Newsgroups: soc.culture.usa, soc.motss,
soc.culture.palestine, alt.homosexual, us.taxes

Date: 20 Sep 2003 12:22:08 -0700

Isn't this the same Susan Cohen who supports the convict, and child molester Ken McVay running the Bnai Brith funded BUSINESS where he cheats JEWS called NIZKOR?
Sounds like 2 of a kind to me....

> From: Fred Cherry (
> Subject: Re: NAMBLA: A conduit for Pedophiles
> Newsgroups: soc.motss,, can.motss,
> sdnet.motss, ba.motss
> Date: 2002-10-04 11:49:43 PST
> In Message-ID:
> <>
> Subject: Re: NAMBLA: A conduit for Pedophiles
> Newsgroups: rec.arts.poems
> Date: 26 Sep 2002 13:03:20 -0700
> (Chuck Lysaght) wrote:
> > It's no surprise that no one in this newsgroup
> > can offer any intelligent comments about the
> > url I posted. Just nonsense, and personal attacks
> > Predictable, but unfortunate for others.
> Chuck, if you think YOU have been the victim of personal
> attacks, you should try to post something directly in
> opposition to something that Susan Cohen posts. Then
> you will REALLY see personal attacks from the
> number-one liar and the number-one supporter of
> NAMBLA on Usenet. Here is an excerpt from a recent
> 221 line diatribe against me, posted in the newsgroup
> alt.politics.homosexuality, Susan Cohen's favorite
> newsgroup. Because of my opposition to NAMBLA,
> Susan Cohen's favorite organization, I have had to
> put up with this sort of thing for about five years.

[ complete text of the post ]

For the record, I have never seen anybody ever offer so much as a single quote of something that Susan Cohen wrote that any sane individual could take to be support for NAMBLA (the North American Man - Boy Love Association, a group dedicated to legalizing sexual relationships between grown men and young, pre-pubescent boys, a position which I have condemned in the past). But even in the absence of evidence, some have tried to offer an alleged absence as evidence, as we see in the case of yet another person fighting to keep Cherry's libel alive:

From: "mhlife"
Newsgroups: alt.gossip.royalty
Subject: Re: Not just Immaturity, but Outright Lies
Date: Fri, 5 Nov 2004 00:22:36 -0000
Lines: 61
Message-ID: <>
References: <hArid.780$oa1.577@trnddc03>

"Jean Sue" <> wrote in message

> in article hArid.780$oa1.577@trnddc03, Susan Cohen
> at
> wrote on 11/4/04 10:06 AM:
> > Even tho' I have told the supposed anti-monarchist
> > filth to stay out of my inbox, I see that not only can
> > they not follow directons, or even obey actual laws -
> > but that "phil" is must be getting *really* desperate.
> > Not only are these lies whoppers, but
> > half of them have been corrected *to his face*
> > (as it were).
> >
> > SusanC
> >
> He posts the "same-old, same-old" and
> we all know it's tripe.

Well, Jean-Sue, I do tend to post tripe - good quality tripe with an extremely high nutritional value, but still tripe.


However, the original post was not an example of my usual menu - and, you might care to note, that Ms 'Cohen' has yet again failed to condemn NAMBLA.

It was Fred Cherry who first drew attention to Susan's alleged enthusiasm for the North American Man Boy Love Association (which is the full title of this most disgusting group of paedophiles) and, as I've already said, I could scarcely believe that Cherry could be correct.

So I searched Google for the exchanges between them - and, sure enough, whenever she was pressed to express abhorrence at the activities of an organisation that actively seeks the legal 'right' to conduct homosexual relationships with children aged from birth onwards, Susan wriggled and jiggled, and evaded giving a straightforward answer. ...

[ full text of original post ]

... and might very well have had excellent reasons to do so, given that crowd's historical fondness for mailbombing and otherwise harassing its critics, as mentioned in the Fred Cherry Story. One need not have any ill motives at all to take a look at the bad experiences others have had when speaking out, and decide that one would rather not be put through that oneself, especially online, given the practice seen out of some ISPs to reward campaigns of online harassment by silencing the people harassed. Assuming, that is, that one can even trust that part of the story that we are being told. Sad to say, many will do just that, without thinking.

Nor is Ms.Cohen the only person that this has been done to, though in her case, the efforts would seem to be unusually blatant exercises in cyberstalking and general abuse.

All of this, as I've said, took place after Fred's alleged demise, and why wouldn't it? Usenet always has more than its share of people who are looking for a little mud to sling, in the hope that it will stick, and Fred's false accusations are preserved in the Googlegroups / Dejanews archives, in large numbers, ready to be dredged up by anybody. In real life, death stills the voice of the neighborhood gossip, but online, one's "voice" lives on in print, or its electronic counterpart, very often. That being the case, the seemingly sensible query "why now" can be seen for what it is - the failure of the complaintant to recognize that the experiences which gave rise to his earlier notions of common sense are no longer a reasonably good guide to the new circumstance which he finds himself in.

If it sounds like I'm suggesting that the introduction of the Dejanews (now Googlegroups) archives was a change for the worse - no, not at all, at least not entirely. In the bad old days, when somebody would play the kind of game Fred and his friends made a name for themselves playing, there was little that one could do to prove that they were lying. Now, with the introduction of a (one hopes) neutral third party keeping the records, documentation and defense of one's reputation, or reputation of another, becomes a real possibility. But Usenet, having become something of a cesspool during those old days, didn't suddenly become a decent place just because a few new tools were introduced, and there will be those who want to misuse those tools. It's up to the rest of us to make a reasonable effort to see to it that they do not succeed in their attempts to do so.

At this point, would you rather go to the ring hubpage on World of Webring or Ringsurf? Or would you rather go to the main page and see if I have anything else on this blog, now that you know what is in store for you? This page ... I mean, post is being mirrored on, on the ring homepage.